E61: Next-level communication
It’s easy to say couples need to communicate more, but sometimes a serious conversation isn’t the answer to a problem. What about non-verbal communication – what part does this play in a relationship? From watching for tells that your partner is upset about something to understanding what messages your behaviour is sending your partner, in this episode, we cover next level communication. If you find verbal talks don’t always help you handle problems in your relationship, this is an important episode.
Listen below or scroll down for the transcript:
Rich: Hello and welcome to episode 61 of ‘From Long Distance to Marriage’. This week we’re going to be revisiting communication. Which we talk about frequently, but we’re going to be talking about the limitations of verbal dialogue and other forms of communication as well as when it’s appropriate to not communicate and just lead with actions and examples.
Aindrea: Let’s do it.
Rich: So, this applies really for any relationship. It’s obviously going to be harder in long distance, if the distance is still there, as in, you know you can do it when you’re together on a visit in person but if you are separated by the miles and you are unable to act, be non verbal in a lot of ways.
Aindrea: Yeah.
Rich: So bare that in mind but there are still certain principles you can put into motion, so for example one of the things is, long distance has the challenge of that there may be a lot of things to talk about. You know, so something we hear quite a lot about is, one person has been really quiet or they’re not necessarily very responsive to certain things, or you know maybe it comes back to love language, they’re not very open with certain things and it makes the dialogue quite difficult and that can make the other person feel worried or frustrated or ‘do they feel the same as I feel?’ And whatever. So, you may say ‘ok let’s talk about that’ and communicate that and that can be effective but sometimes it’s about leading by example. Sometimes what you need in a relationship, and I think more so when the distance isn’t there, is just some leadership. I know this is something that we have dealt with isn’t it?
Aindrea: Yes.
Rich: Sometimes just do it or, in a lot of cases when someone starts to do something it just influences the other person.
Aindrea: Can you give an example, like a concrete example? This might be a bit abstract I think.
Rich: Well I suppose, like you know if you talk about, say, fitness. If you’re doing something, if you’re starting to make that change, and start to take your health, maybe eat better or just work out more, then it can just inspire the people around you to actually think ‘if they’re doing it I can do the same too.’ You can have that conversation in advance but that conversation could be difficult, it could be “I think you need to work out” “I want us to do this together”, you know what I mean it can feel a bit parental or attacking, like “what do you mean I need to work out?”, whereas you can just say “okay I’m doing this for me” and it has the knock on effect that the other person notices it and other people in your life notice it. That’s just one example but it apples to everything. Oh I noticed if you’re married or if you live together its “oh I’ve really noticed you’re taking more care around the house.”
Aindrea: Yes.
Rich: You know “actually you’re right maybe we could be a bit more house proud” and you know people are not stupid, people observe and notice things so, sometimes a conversation can feel a bit negative, a bit like you’re being picked on; even if you’ve got the purest intentions in the world just the nature of the conversation can feel that way. And also you know sometimes it can be a bit exhausting, just to talk all the time, “oh we’ve got to do this now, we’ve got to do that now”. I just think on the flip side to that if you are the person that’s noticed something, just take charge of it. This works, we were talking about date night recently, if you say “hey, get your clothes on”… not that you’d be naked but “get some nice clothes on.”
Aindrea: Get your clothes on *laughing*
Rich: “We’re going out for date, we’re going to see a movie, we’re going out for dinner.”
Aindrea: But I think that’s a really important, the few examples you’ve had I think, sometimes depending on the situation especially if it’s been an ongoing area, not necessarily a point of contention, but an area you have both addressed before, sometimes a conversation can almost make it worse or make it feel worse, but that doesn’t mean that communication in some way isn’t the key. By just doing something it does set that example and can make it a bit less, I guess confrontational is the closest word.
Rich: Yeah because I still say this is communication but it is non-verbal.
Aindrea: Well yeah.
Rich: You’re still saying, it’s not a body language type thing. 10% of communication is verbal the rest is body language but this is non-verbal in the sense of you’re taking action, that just really inspires and also I think it works the other way, people can really easily drag each other down, it’s like “I want to sit on the couch all day” and the other person is going to go “yeah I can do that, there’s no effort for me to do that.” We all know how easy it is to be lazy, to just eat junk food all day. And that’s really easy to do that. There is no effort involved in that. So you may need a kick up the arse a little bit to get going. “You know what, I’m just going to get up and tidy round the house a little bit,” then the other person might say “oh yeah this does look nice, yeah, I’m going to make an effort to do this too.” Start by making the bed. It doesn’t have to be redecorating but just take that charge.
Aindrea: I think doing that is also communicating to your partner what you want by showing them. Like you said, people are not stupid and we’ve had periods in our relationship where one or the other of us is doing that and is just kind of going, “do you know what, I’m just going to do this” and I’ve noticed it and there’s still that feeling of, “okay he’s doing this which means I’m not doing enough of it.”
Rich: Yeah and also this can solve a lot of frustrations that may or may not be known about, again one of the things we hear quite a lot is laziness in our partner “oh he doesn’t do anything…”
Aindrea: Or lack of motivation.
Rich: “He just sits down smokes weed all day, plays video games, doesn’t do anything, how can I get him to do something?” That’s a conversation if you were to have verbally, where it’s really hard for him not to feel attacked, because you’re coming at him or her, whatever, you’re coming at that person with negatives, now it may be that actually by you leading by example it makes that person feel as though “I don’t need to do that.”
Aindrea: It’s hard though because this doesn’t have a 100% success rate, you know, there have been multiple things in our marriage we’ve harped on about each other for years and then one of us will start like “okay, fine I will take care of it” and that behaviour still hasn’t changed.
Rich: Yeah, well okay what I was going to say there is, sometimes doing it makes the person who isn’t doing it makes them think “oh I haven’t got to worry about that” but then it becomes almost like a parent and child relationship. So, if you’re not able to have the verbal communication, it’s not effective, and then if taking charge of it and the other person just thinks “great, something not for me to have to worry about, I can sit here and just get stoned all day” then you need to look for something else. Maybe you do need to have a more serious conversation, maybe you do need to say “look this is what I need and expect from my partner in a relationship and that either is you or is not you” sometimes that doesn’t need to be said. We’re lucky we haven’t had to do that.
Aindrea: Yeah some days I feel like it *laughing*
Rich: There will be a relationship where that does happen, especially if you’re younger, maybe there’s less experience with relationships and again, especially if you’re new to living together, then you’ve got that, trying to figure out how to go from my life being all about me and doing what I want when I want, to suddenly sharing it. This doesn’t happen overnight, it doesn’t happen in the first week, there’s that bedding in period that we’ve spoken about before a bit, but if at some point it’s not happening, then you need to have that conversation. You do need to state your boundaries and you say “you need to sharpen these areas” so don’t be afraid of that.
Aindrea: Yeah, but I think you need to try, it’s always going to start with “hey, could you do this” or “why aren’t you doing this” and then, yeah, you need to try if that doesn’t work, some I’m going to lead. But you need to be careful that it doesn’t end up like some form of battle, kind of like, I guess what I’m imagining is, what’s that movie with Jennifer Aniston and Vince Vaughn? The Break Up, where they’re just like, it’s almost like a battle, to show each other this is how it should be.
Rich: Then it becomes attrition, the other thing is it’s more acceptable to ask for help when you’re already doing something. So let’s say we’re both sat on the couch and I say “oh can you do that” you can justifiably say to me “why the fuck don’t you do that” when we’re both doing nothing. But, what we both have done frequently is one of us will be doing something and saying “oh while I’m doing this, could you just do this for me?” maybe I’m mowing the lawn and you say “oh I will do this in the kitchen” or whatever, it doesn’t matter what examples are, but the point is they can seethe effort being made, they can say “well actually that does need doing, they’re busy, they’re busy doing something that benefits both of us making the house look nice or whatever it may be, I’m happy to do that.” Basically, what I’m saying is, evaluate and just be conscious of what you’re doing when you’re asking, if you’re doing nothing and you’re asking for favours is there a reason why you can’t do it? If they turn round and say “why have I got to do that?” have you got a good answer for that? Sometimes, we’ve had it where we have just got back into the gym haven’t we, and it’s like I can’t move, my legs hurt, I need some help but then you’ve got a reason for that. If it’s like “I can’t be bothered” then they kinda have every right to turn around and say no. But if you’re doing something and you’re busy and you’re leading by example, then they’re going to be more inclined, most of the time.
Andrea: Yeah, and I think, it will get to a point, we had an episode a while back now, with Dovid Feldman, where it was kind of, you know if you really need something.
Rich: Episode 47 Dealing with Criticism.
Andrea: How did you know that that was the number?
Rich: Because I was talking to someone about it recently.
Andrea: Okay, well 47, so yeah it was all about avoiding criticism and if you ask someone to do something and they don’t pay attention and you tried to lead by example it still doesn’t seem to be going through, the next step is using verbal communication but not putting it on them. You know, “when you don’t do this it makes me feel like this” and I think that’s a really good thing to do but the fact is it doesn’t always work. I think we have both tried that in our relationship and it still doesn’t necessarily get through to one another.
Rich: Yeah.
Aindrea: Then what? What are you supposed to do? When I do it to you and you don’t connect and when you do it to me and I don’t get it. What now?
Rich: Dovid gave a really really good point about it. He elaborated on the hierarchy of needs which I thought was great. So for anyone that hasn’t listened to that episode, 1 – we recommend you do because it’s all about how to avoid criticism and when Dovid says never criticise your partner invariably the response he gets is “how do I get them to change?” So he dealt with that, so if there’s anything you are dealing with we recommend that episode. But essentially we had a conversation around, the example I gave was, say I always left my clothes on the floor and it drives you crazy, how would he handle that and one of the things he said was that you have a hierarchy of needs in a relationship. Write up what yours are, and it could be the most important things to me are just love and attention and being provided for and whatever, and the next least important thing is whatever. If clothes not being on the floor is not on that list then it’s not worth the conversation and, you know, “I will just pick them up and fold them, it’s not a big deal.” He also made the point that he would never expect his partner to do something he wasn’t capable of doing himself. If his spouse made him dinner then he would be extremely grateful for it but would never expect it, it’s the little things, it’s a really valuable episode. It can really shift some thinking on expectations of who brings what to the table.
Aindrea: Particularly for men.
Rich: Yeah I think that’s true. Then the other thing around this sort of communication, this is worth a conversation upfront in a relationship, maybe you can revisit it down the line, people have different desires as well, there are some people who kind of want to be led in a relationship you know the so-called, I’m going to say dominance, but not in a kinky way.
Aindrea: Personality.
Rich: Yeah, that person takes charge. Again, not really in a parental kind of way but “I just trust them, they make these decisions, I follow their lead.” If you’re the kind of person that needs that and your partner isn’t bringing that you’re going to feel frustrated and maybe you don’t really realise that’s why you’re frustrated until you get it. Then it’s “oh actually that’s been the cause of that.” That’s what we’re trying to get at in this episode is that verbal communication is great, but you don’t always know what the problem is, you can just say “I feel really frustrated, I’m really irritated, I can’t put my finger on it.” So then you know maybe you do know, “actually I know that I want my partner to be the leader.”
Aindrea: Yeah.
Rich: And that doesn’t mean you can’t have opinions, doesn’t mean you can’t disagree, doesn’t mean you have nothing to do but go shopping, it just means that maybe you haven’t got that burden.
Aindrea: I think there are a lot of different personality types and I think a lot of people are leaders and they strive in that sort of setting and others are excellent supporters and I think that’s kind of similar to what we are. I think you’re more of a natural born leader, I’m more of an executor and give me good directions I will make something happen, great, and I will get it done quickly. But I think also there’s different aspects of relationships where you’re leader and where you’re kind of the supporter, so there’s certain areas where you’re very much the leader and there’s areas where I am certainly more of the leader and you just have to know what those roles are.
Rich: Yeah and this is where, the conversation around equality isn’t necessarily true, so, I would say there’s equality in the sense of what you just said, sometimes I take the lead sometimes you take the lead. It’s equal when we don’t say “hang on, oh that’s my job” or “that’s your job” but I think there are some people who say everything we do has to be 50/50 and I think you’re going to run into problems with that because some situations one person just knows more about it, has more experience about it or is just right about it. And the other person is like “well, no I’m not sure” and that can prevent the right decision being made just because they may be a bit nervous about it, maybe slightly ignorant on it. Let’s just say money for example, because it’s an obvious one. If one person has more knowledge and experience about what to do with money and the other’s like “oh I don’t know” then you end up doing nothing and then that’s caused a problem. So, I think the real equality there is, you let the person who has the knowledge and the experience say “this is what I recommend, this is what I think we should do” then in another situation, let’s think of an example, help me think of an example?
Aindrea: Cooking…
Rich: Yeah. Then that person says “okay this is how I’m going to take charge here,” so you’ve got the equality across, your ability to have influence but you don’t make every single decision 50/50. I think you’re kind of asking for trouble if you do that.
Aindrea: But yeah, 50/50 is just kind of a made up thing really. I mean I think you should each have equal say/sway in a relationship but I think the kind of examples you just gave, you’ve worked in financial companies before, you’re much more versed in different things with finance, I have really good common sense when it comes to that kind of stuff but maybe not, I wouldn’t say formal education, but let’s use that for a better term but it won’t even occur to me that we should be doing something different with our money and you’ll say “oh you know, what about this” and you’ll ask for my opinion and we’ll look into it and you’ll bring me back some facts and we will discuss it together. You take the lead on that but my opinion is still very much…
Rich: Yeah I want you to be comfortable with it and if you’re not then I’ll take the time to say why I think it’s important.
Aindrea: Yeah and then like with the food thing, you know I’m pretty much the shopper, the cooker, the planner when it comes to our food and there is actually quite a lot of responsibility to that, it might sound silly but there is and then when you’re saying, you mentioned, I really need to get back into the gym, trying to get a bit more fit and health conscious. You know you said something the other day about how you’ve been feeling and I said “maybe you should try cutting gluten out like I have, I’ll make sure to change the shopping list.” It may sound like trivial stuff but actually it just takes the worry off the other one because that’s an area where you can lead effectively.
Rich: Well and that’s the thing as well, your frustrations and stress can just, maybe, without you knowing it but they can be massively influenced by having too much on your plate. So if the other person is leading in certain areas and it’s something for you not to worry about that frees up a lot of mental energy for other things, and you know going back to, you said before that some people are leaders, some people aren’t so much. I think the elephant in the room with relationships is compatibility. So, we obviously advocate and everyone advocates working on it, you know, find the resolution, discuss things, have the conversation, take charge here and there, and the phrase you hear all the time, is you know “if he loves you he will do this“, “if you love each other it will work out” and the truth is a lot of people love each other and still get divorced, still break up, things still go wrong, love isn’t always enough. That can sound a bit harsh, but you’re just not always compatible and I think, and this may be particularly pertinent to long distance relationships, it’s very easy to fall in love with the idea of someone. What I mean by that is maybe less of an issue now that there is much more video communication or when you are introduced to someone through distance you only get exposure to a certain bit of them, maybe that’s their voice on a video chat, you’re gaming together, and you’ve got the headphones on you’ll hear their voice, you can have a really really sexy voice and then suddenly that builds up a picture in your mind of that person’s got a real aura to them, equally you may see a picture of them and think yeah you know they’re a beautiful person and the conversations that you have early on can be normally pretty good, so suddenly you’ve got this, “ah yeah there’s this beautiful person,” and because we’re so attracted to what we perceive to be attractive we immediately see that person as positive and good so you can kind of forgive a lot I think, so what I’m saying is you have this idea of, “I love this person’s voice, it’s a really really sexy voice” or “their picture’s fantastic” or whatever, and then you can kind of go in to talking to them with them already being good in your mind, like a positive thing, so then over time you just build up who you think they are, almost like a character in a book to an extent. It’s like “this is what they look like to me in my mind” and I think that can be surprisingly powerful and it can surprisingly last a long time so if you’re bumping into certain issues that maybe you wouldn’t expect to early on, it’s worth probably just taking a step back and thinking “do I love this person or do I love what I perceive them to be in my mind?”
Aindrea: And on that, you know maybe a step further when you know, “yeah actually I do love this person” but there are things/needs of yours that aren’t being met or pet peeves of yours that they’re constantly doing, that’s also something that you need to take a step back with and say to yourself, you kind of have that internal conversation, “is this actually a shortcoming of theirs or is this an unrealistic expectation of mine?”
Rich: Yes, totally.
Aindrea: And maybe it’s somewhere in between, maybe it is a bit unrealistic but it’s still really really important to you and it’s just something they’re not valuing at all and you need to meet somewhere in the middle and I think, again, this will always involve verbal communication but I think a big part of what we’re talking about here is looking at the non verbal queues and kind of hints that you’re seeing in your partner’s behaviour, their habits, the traits that they’re kind of showing you. I mean we had kind of a conversation, god, it’s probably been 3 or 4 years ago now, we were actually away in America and I wasn’t even aware of it but I’d obviously been communicating to you with my behaviour and my body language that I was really unhappy about something and you know, we had a moment alone. You kind of, I wouldn’t say corner, but you kind of did corner me and said “look I notice you’ve been acting this, this and this way towards me and I get the feeling that it’s because of something I’m doing?” and it just opened up a conversation and it was one of those things like where you said a few minutes ago, sometimes you don’t even know what’s bothering you, I didn’t even realise I’d been acting that way, I didn’t even realise I’d been unhappy with some things but just you saying to me like “look, what’s going on? I’m happy to take responsibility for whatever this is” and it just kind of opened up the flood gates, not that I was like balling or anything but it was just like “I feel like this and I feel like this and I just feel like this doesn’t matter, blah blah blah,” and you know we really made some good… do you remember that? What I’m talking about…
Rich: Yeah, I don’t know what it was.
Aindrea: We don’t need to get into that, but, it’s just you know, so yeah, it might have ended up in a verbal conversation, but you were picking on those physical behavioural things.
Rich: If I’d waited for you to initiate it, it may never have happened.
Aindrea: Or it could have been really messy.
Rich: Because the thing is with humans we’re a really adaptable species, we can get used to anything, we can get used to a lot of things very quickly, you know especially when it’s a gently gently change, over a period of time, you wake up one day unhappy then you know you’re unhappy, but if it happens over a longer period of time that something is bothering you or you’re frustrated, you kind of just get used to it and that’s quite dangerous because you accept it and you forget what it used to be like. So just kind of using the example you gave, it can take someone external saying “this isn’t normal for you” so it’s good to just, not everything has to be dealt with on day one, but just remember what normal and good is for you, so you can keep that on line; you don’t want to veer off too much and get sucked in to it because then six months down the line this is your new normal and it’s actually really bad for you.
Aindrea: Yeah, and you know there’s a balance of speaking up and standing up for yourself, and also, kind of realising your partner’s needs too in this, and again, I can’t stress how important it is to know your partner’s tells or the giveaways that something’s bothering them, you know like, you can tell if I’m kind of messing with my fingernails.
Rich: Yeah, and that’s something I could tell when from when we used to talk on webcam, I could see it’s a physical thing you do.
Aindrea: It’s a tic I do when I’m upset and stressed, like rubbing my thumb.
Rich: And you may not even know you’re doing it.
Aindrea: Yeah.
Rich: Maybe you do but I can tell immediately there’s something you need to talk about and I’m sure everyone has something, it doesn’t have to be that physical, it can be that you’re really quiet today; I used to work with someone who would sort of play with his hair a little bit if he was stressed at work and I think everyone has some kind of giveaway, you’re talking a lot more than normal or you’re not talking at all or you seem distracted or you’re just snapping at me, just look for the sign and then say “what’s bothering you?” you can initiate that conversation, it doesn’t have to be from the person who has the problem.
Aindrea: And I think something else that you need to do it in the right way, not when you’re necessarily seeing those little tics that means they’re worried or stressed or kind of little habit things but, say for instance, your partner’s tone with you has been really short and impatient and snappy and you know that means that there’s something wrong with them, you can’t do anything more damaging than go “what the fuck is wrong with you?” We’re guilty of it and I think men probably do it more to women because women can be so much more emotionally reactive and something can just set us off and we go, because we keep so much in but that is so damaging and it’s led to a lot of fights and I mean, I remember talking to a friend at work and she’s like “don’t you hate it when you’ve had an argument with them and then you’re shitty because they’ve made you upset and then it’s like oh you going to act like this all day?’” ‘well yeah because you fucking made me act this way.’”
Rich: Yeah, it’s true, we’re not perfect in this but if someone is opening up to you about anything, I mean even if what we’re talking about now or if they open about their sexual fantasies or anything, the last thing you should do is make them feel stupid or be judgey, just listen to it.
Aindrea: But if you do need to ask, even if they’re upsetting you, they’re being really snappy, you know I think, we’ve had multiple episodes where we’ve said we don’t ever want to hurt each other or our intention to be a dick to one another.
Rich: But it happens.
Aindrea: Yeah, I’ve forgot the couple’s name, I’ve gone completely blank, the long distance activity.
Rich: Sam and Jared.
Aindrea: Yeah, Sam and Jared, sorry I’m just losing names, you know Jared said that thing “always assume good intent” and I don’t know that we always have good intent but sometimes there’s not intent we say, we’re not trying to achieve anything good we’re not trying to achieve anything bad, we’re just saying what we feel.
Rich: Yeah.
Aindrea: And people are allowed that.
Rich: We are reactive, a lot of people generally because if someone says something you respond like that, you don’t always have time to think “hang on, what did they say?”, a lot of this is practice and trial and error and then if it goes wrong, we put in one of our earlier episodes, “the benefits of arguing”, you do learn, “hang on if I say that, they’re going to react that way,” and that’s the benefit of a long term relationship, you learn that person really really well.
Aindrea: But we’re also just human, if you’re generally upset about something and you just come off a bit shitty you know that is allowed, but then if you generally can’t help it and you’re really upset and hurting about something then the responsibility is on your partner to not respond in an agitated way, and go “he or she’s acting like this because she’s very hurt because I’ve done something unintentionally to make them feel this way so now I need to set the tone for this, ‘ok what’s wrong? You’re obviously really upset’ not ‘what the fuck’s wrong with you, why are you acting this way?’”
Rich: You have the responsibility to just know when they’re getting something off their chest, whatever they say you just accept it and when it’s done and they’ve got it out and they’re purged, then you can say “ok shall we talk about this?” Or whatever it may be.
Aindrea: And it’s hard because you can sometimes feel like you’re the punching bag but when you share a life with someone, sometimes you need to be at different points in life, everything for them, whether that’s a best friend, lover – hopefully that’s continually – sometimes you might need to a little bit parental to that person, there’s been a lot of times where you’ve had to be parental towards me because I don’t have a parent figure here and I come to you for advice or maybe call me on some behaviour, we do that for each other.
Rich: Yeah, I mean you spend all your time with one person, they’re going to see every aspect of you.
Aindrea: Yeah, so sometimes you have to suck it up and be the punching bag a little bit and let them take that out, and then hopefully afterwards they realise I’m not actually…
Rich: But just going back, when we touched on the compatibility side of this, I think it’s really valuable for most people, if your relationship is going really well and you’re 10 years into it and stuff maybe certainly in the early days, certainly if you’re single, if something’s bothering you it would be good if you just write down bullet points, pros and cons, or just freestyle writing, just write pen to paper of what’s important to you in a relationship, so don’t think about your partner, if you’re single then that doesn’t apply, if not single block them out for a minute, this is just about the good and bad of what you want in a relationship, what you need in a relationship, what you’re willing to put up with in a relationship, maybe that’s “I need someone who leads, I need someone who earns more money than me, I need someone who’s proactive, I need someone who x y z.” That’s your needs, and wants might be “I need someone who’s taller than me, I need someone who’s physically fit and looks after themselves, I want someone who enjoys the same films as I do.” I’m making all this up by the way. Then the things I’m going to put up with are, “I’m willing to put up with clothes on the floor, I’m willing to put up with them being bad with time, I’m willing to put up with them smoking weed and playing video games all day.” But you just, you know, if you have that you can come back to the hierarchies that if you have that you see where your red lines are, if you then, going back to the example of that hypothetical friend who spends all day playing video games, smoking weed, doing nothing even if their partner’s out working and they’re at home doing nothing and they’re just frustrating you, you’ve got this, you don’t necessarily have to share this with them, you know “they’re crossing a few of my red lines and I need to have a conversation with them,” if you say to them “look I need you to turn up in these ways because I’m currently the only one working, I come home after a long day and you expect me to then cook and clean and you’ve done nothing all day, I need this, this and this” but then the compatibility aspect of this is, if nothing changes and they don’t get it and they don’t understand where you’re coming from and they see you as a nag and they’re basically treating you like a mother, and they’re treating the house like living back at home or a hotel, then it doesn’t sound like you’re compatible and that’s harsh but kind of true really.
Aindrea: I don’t know…
Rich: You can be happier with them but then people get really scared at the prospect of being single voluntarily, of “what if I don’t have find someone else? I really like these things about that person.” You will always have something that you like about that person or about that person, people stay in really toxic and unhealthy, bad relationships because there are aspects of that person they like, because people aren’t binaries like oh he’s good he’s bad, everyone’s got good about them but don’t let that trick you into staying with them, but you’re going to disagree with me there are you?
Aindrea: Well no, because maybe, I think it depends, I mean I definitely agree that certainly sometimes people aren’t compatible or it’s not going to work out but I still think that, if someone generally loves you and wants to make you happy, not that you should be willing to change but they should want to change themselves, so if it is because, let’s be honest, neither of us are tidy neat freaks but I probably do a lot more around the house than you, and not that you treat me like, “oh you’re my mum you should be sorting this out, this is what it’s like,” but you’re allowed to have conversation like “hey, you’re not pulling your weight”
Rich: Of course! Yeah, so this is…
Aindrea: Maybe you meant in a much more severe case?
Rich: Yeah, what I was talking about was if you’ve got these red lines, and I agree with you, we have both moved along with certain aspect of change for the other person, or just where we’ve helped each other grow or just with age and maturity we have changed but what I’m saying is if you go that the person and say none of this is happening for me and I really really need these things to be happening, these are the things I need in a relationship. If they try and say “ok, thanks for sharing I’ll try” and sure it won’t happen overnight, maybe you will need to remind them occasionally then that’s fine. But if they turn around and say “why are you nagging me, fuck this, do you know who I am, you should love me for who I am,” because that’s always the fall back, “you should love me for who I am,” then it doesn’t sound like there’s a lot of compatibility. Imagine work, you’re in a job or maybe you get a new job or whatever it is, and at some point your manager might say to you “these are your responsibilities, this is what we expect from you.” I’m not saying a relationship is like work, what I was going to say was if you don’t do that, they don’t have a conversation with you every week and say “okay, remember I need you to do this,” they say, they expect you to be an adult about it and say “this is what I need from you,” then what happens if it’s not done, eventually you get disciplined, disciplinary meetings, you get fired. They don’t expect to have to tell you every week and I think it’s the same in a relationship. You shouldn’t have to, some things, minor things like “why are you leaving your clothes on the floor again, why didn’t you pick your shoes up?” minor things that you find, like your big red lines, and if they’re not moving off that couch then they’re just doing nothing or whatever you’ve put in your needs column and none of them are being met, if you say to someone these are some of the things I need, you’re capable of meeting them, you shouldn’t have to remind them every week. If the relationship isn’t a net benefit for you, if your life is not enhanced in some way as a result of that relationship then you shouldn’t be in it.
Aindrea: Yeah.
Rich: You know…
Aindrea: You should be adding values.
Rich: I saw a question put online the other day, I can’t remember the exact words but it was to the effect “is your life better with your relationship?” now I didn’t really hang around to look at the results of that but if the answer’s no, get out! Or you work to fix it; obviously you might just be digging a bit of a rut but…
Aindrea: Change something…
Rich: Relationships should be benefiting, your life should be better with it than without it otherwise what are you doing in it? And I think for me that’s the fundamental thing, it obviously helps to know who you are, if you desire to be led or desire to be the leader or you desire this that and the other, and don’t be superficial about it, you know “I really want blonde hair, blue eyes, super fit, vegan, this that and the other,” there are going to be areas of compromise and we all know that the person that actually ends up sweeping us off our feet is the person that we didn’t necessarily picture in our mind and that’s fine, that’s life, that’s a bit of excitement and drama, the most important thing is you should be understood.
Aindrea: Yeah, absolutely.
Rich: We should probably mention, people probably don’t know that we offer coaching to couples, so if you’re having troubles you think we could help with, individually or as a couple online, we can talk on Skype and whatever. Get in touch with us, send us an email. If you just visit our website longdistancetomarriage.com and visit the contact page, let us know and we can work on that and try and help you. This is a good episode to mention that from, because we have spoken about a lot of different scenarios and obviously what are reasonable expectations, when are you being the one being unfair with what you need and you need your partner to turn up with. The other thing is, you mentioned this earlier on, if you’ve got unrealistic expectations you’re going to bump into these problems. You could get a new partner every week and these problems will follow you. So yeah if there’s something you think we could help you with send us an email or a tweet or an Instagram message, however you find us, a message in a bottle or anything.
Aindrea: That’s silly because we are nowhere near water.
Rich: That’s true, if you think that will get here – it won’t. Just get in touch with us.
Aindrea: I mean unrealistic expectations.
Rich: You’ve called me up on it, you just communicated that to me.
Aindrea: Yes, very well, I think, yeah we should also mention on that topic you know, we both have been through quite a lot together so, no judgement on stuff, if there’s anything you want to talk about.
Rich: It’s true, you know we’ve been married, this will be 9 years this year! So we’ve kind of, obviously, not everything, there is a lot of things that we haven’t gone through but there is a lot of things we have gone through. We are happy to help and share our experiences, so this shouldn’t be a depressing episode this is just to say, when you hear people say, or even if you say “I’ve got this problem and someone says ‘oh communicate,’” that’s all someone’s going to say, and communication is incredibly important, this is just about the distinction between the types of communication and trying to recognise when communication is not necessarily the best response verbally. Sometimes recognising when, “okay I need to lead by example here” or “I’m picking up nonverbal cues from you, that something’s bothering you and I’m going to bring it up and not wait for you to bring it up” or “I’ve got my wants, needs and preferences and things like that, and things I cant possibly deal with in a relationship and I’ve got that written down and my partner’s crossing all of those and I need to have a frank conversation with them” and you know sometimes you’re better of walking away from a relationship. So this is just a more general approach to what communication is, what it looks like, what it can and can’t be; it’s not always a “hey babe, let’s sit down, have a conversation” so formal about it and we are emotional creatures and we adapt and we respond. So if we see something important to the person you love then it should become important to us as well. This is where leading by example really comes in.
Aindrea: I think it’s also looking at your behaviour to your partner and if that is communicating how you feel, as if you know for instance, say the clothes on the floor are really a big deal to your partner, and you leave your clothes on the floor and they’ve communicated this to you, this communicates that you don’t care about the state of our home or you don’t care about my time again, yeah okay picking someone’s clothes off the floor takes four seconds, but it’s the principle of it, you know whether you’re at home with kids and you have your hands full, and you both work very hard, demanding jobs. What your communicating to me now is that you don’t know that, that this job is beneath you or my time isn’t as valuable as yours and maybe they don’t know that, and you need to reflect, say “okay this is really important to them, what am I actually saying by doing this thing they don’t like?”
Rich: Yeah and then you can also think, “what’s the other reason they’re not doing this?” 1. It’s not important to them to put their clothes away but, so for example we have a hamper so for us putting our clothes on the floor is lazy because there is a hamper right there. So maybe in this hypothetical scenario the reason they’re putting their clothes on the floor is because there isn’t a hamper. “Well I don’t want to put them back in the wardrobe or the drawers because I’ve worn them, and I want to get into bed.” It can be really important to you that the clothes aren’t on the floor but this doesn’t mean that’s where your responsibility to the problem ends because it’s still your annoyance, it’s still the thing that bothers you and not them and you want them to change but you have to appreciate well, they’re not going to go all the way to the laundry basket to do that and whatever. So you can say “okay, hey I got this little hamper or basket” or whatever it may be, or even if it’s “I put them in that drawer over there, I’ll take them downstairs in the morning.” But if you can work to provide some solution to it, to compromise to it, then you can kind of sort your own problem out there and then. If they still don’t do it then it’s a different conversation. Then it’s “hey I provided this solution and you’ve got to walk two feet to the laundry basket and now it feels like you’re disrespectful to me.” It’s different. You can still work to provide a solution or a compromise or whatever.
Aindrea: Yeah, absolutely, just be mindful and be respectful and just realise, one of the things that really gets me is people always say we’re always responsible for our own emotions and no one should really affect our state of mind. I don’t believe that. I think we are responsible for our reactions but that doesn’t mean other people’s actions don’t directly affect the state of our emotions. When you’re someone’s partner that’s a big responsibility, you shouldn’t have to feel as if you’re walking on eggshells really, but you know, be willing to listen, “you’ve done this, it’s made me feel this way” and then “what are you going to do about it?”
Rich: Yeah especially if it’s a longer term relationship and you know what your partner reacts to; so both of us could say something that we know really really upsets and irritates the other person, it can be hurtful so, yeah you can control your reactions but you’re right that the better you know someone the greater your responsibility to know. I know if I say that, that’s going to cause some hurt. So hopefully this has been helpful. Like we said, if there is anything we can help you with, if you want some coaching sessions with us we can arrange something. I’d be interested to know that the frustrations along the line of this episode that you have dealt with, if you’ve found resolutions we’ve not discussed, we’d love to hear that too. And until next week…
Aindrea: Have a great week everyone! Bye